ISLAMONLINE: Bismillahir Rahman er-Rahim. This is Ali Al-Halawani from Egypt from islamonline.net. I am the managing editor of the Shari’ah Department. I am the Deputy Editor in Chief of the whole website. And now I am interviewing Mr. Adnan Oktar on his idea and his goal about establishing a Turkish-Islamic Union. And inshaAllah dear viewers we are gonna see his views on this. My first question to Mr. Adnan would you please introduce yourself for our audience?
ADNAN OKTAR: Yes, I was born in Ankara on February 2nd, 1956. I attended primary, middle and high school in Ankara. In 1979 I won a place at the Fındıklı Academy of Fine Arts. I came third. After entering that academy, I have studied there about three years. In 1983 I transferred to the Istanbul University Philosophy Department. I continued my education there, but due to the anarchy and terror at the time I couldn’t contunie my education. I then concentrated on my books and CDs. And that all worked out for the best, insha’Allah.
ISLAMONLINE: MashaAllah. Mr. Adnan as I have told you, before conducting this interview, I have read a lot of your books and your outputs. And on Islam Online we usually publish your articles and also your books as well.
ADNAN OKTAR: Masha’Allah.
ISLAMONLINE: And before I start talking about that union, I need to know your, you know, what in your view are the greatest problem facing Muslims in general?
ADNAN OKTAR: Muslims have a lack of love towards eachother. They should be full of love for one another. Sectarian differences, tariqat differences are not obstacles to love. One can be a Shiite, or a Sunni, a Jaferite or a Nakshibendi, or a member of Kadiri sect, it doesn’t matter at all. All Muslims must love one another with great fervor. We must even love the People of the Book. We must regard them as brothers too. I mean the Christians and Jews too, because they also believe in the Oneness of Allah. They also believe in Paradise and Hell. They also believe in the lawful and unlawful acts. Of course, there may be some divergences, some deficiencies, but in the general meaning of the word, we are by and large in agreement, which means we must be full of love towards them as well. We must feel affection for them in order to win over the ignorant, the unenlightened people. It is very important for Muslims to be allied among themselves, to love another, to protect and watch over one another, and to support the truth with all their strength. The bond of brotherhood between your web site and us is very excellent, for instance. That is one example, and that is how it should be. Muslims must protect, watch over and support one another with all their might.
ISLAMONLINE: Given this, what areas do you mean when you refer to the Turkish Islamic Union?
ADNAN OKTAR: We are living in the End of Times. We are in the End of Times described by Rasulullah. As clearly stated in the hadith related by Suyuti, the likely life expectancy of the Ummah is up until the year 1500 Hagira style. Blessed Said Nursi says Doomsday will take place in around 1545. Many hadith related by Suyuti state that the Ummah will survive until 1500 many times. In other words, there is no doubt on the subject. All the portents of the coming of Hazrat Mahdi (as), of the appearance of Hazrat Mahdi have taken place. Just about all the portents of the return of the Prophet Jesus have come about. A glorious inclination towards Islam has begun in the world. These are all clear signs that the coming of Hazrat Mahdi (as) and the Prophet Jesus is imminent.
ISLAMONLINE: Sir, how can you establish this islamic unity and at the same time enable the member states to preserve their independence, national borders, rights and interests?
ADNAN OKTAR: Of course. Each state will have its own system within its own national borders under the governance of their own national states. But this is a union of brotherhood, love and friendship. It will have a spiritual foundation. That is the moral values of Islam. It will have a joyous spirit of love and solidarity based on the moral values of Islam, and it will aim toward global disarmament. It will aim to win over and to love everyone. It will include Israel and Armenia. It will include Russia. But it will be under Turkey’s leadership, Turkish leadership. There are hadith saying that the Turkic states will unite, that the Turkic states will coalesce first. We can see this in several hadith. And even without the hadith, historic and sociological facts indicate this. The leadership of Turkey is seen very clearly. Turkey follows a line that favors peace and love. That is how it is now. That is how its attitude is. As a result of this activity, all the Turkic states will come together and there will be a great unification. They will carry out this work as the leader of the Islamic world. When this great union that includes Israel Armenia and Russia is established, friendship, brotherhood and peace will become an essential feature of the world. But the leader of this union will be Hazrat Mahdi (as). In other words, Allah is preparing the world for this age. The current economic crisis is a portent of the coming of Hazrat Mahdi (as), and this has been described in great detail. Many events that will happen before and after the time of this economic crisis have been described in detail, and they have all taken place just as stated. The same thing applies to declining rainfall. When rainfall declined, people tried to interpret this in very different ways. They attributed it to global warming, but that is of course not the case. It has nothing to do with global warming. It was a portent of the End of Times, and that portent of the End of Times has come about. There was no rain for a few years, following which powerful rains began. The drought came to an end, but the economic crisis began in the same period. It began in 2007 and will continue until 2014. When we look at these things and also at the signs of the End of Times we see the End of Times is developing in all its glory and all its power.
ISLAMONLINE: Okay you’ve mentioned that Turkey is going to be the leader of this Islamic Union. My question is what makes Turkey eligible to this union and why not any other Islamic country?
ADNAN OKTAR: Leaders emerge naturally. It is the natural leader. No other Islamic country is currently asking for such a post, there is no appearance of that. Neither do they appear to have the strength to discharge it. But our source of information is of course the hadith. Hazrat Mahdi (as) will appear in Istanbul. The holy relics are in Istanbul. When we look at the hadith we see that the Turks will serve in regard to this matter, we see that Hazrat Mahdi (as) will emerge from among the Turks. It is said that Hazrat Mahdi (as) will appear in Rum. And at that time Anatolia was referred to as Rum region. And it is said that Hazrat Mahdi (as) will never leave Rum, that he will never leave is homeland. That is an attribute of Hazrat Mahdi (as). In each and every hadith we look at, regarding this matter, we see the truth of these matters. And we also see it from the course of history. We see it when we talk to people in Islamic countries. That is the general opinion of all.
ISLAMONLINE: You mentioned that the Mahdi will be born here, in Istanbul?
ADNAN OKTAR: No, it is said that he will be born in Medina. It is just referred to as a "town", it is referred to as Medina, not a specific town is mentioned. But the accounts say he will emerge from a village called Kara. There is such an account. But we are told he will be born in Medina. It is not clear which town.
ISLAMONLINE: Back to the nature of the Islamic Union itself, what sort of political power such union will have?
ADNAN OKTAR: Its principal propulsive forces are love, peace, brotherhood, disarmament and justice. Meaning both legal justice and social justice. It will be founded on that. It will be based on love and fear of Allah. And its policies will favor freedom and contemporaneity, a modern world and the development of art and culture, and it will lead a policy with the objectives of wealth, health, happiness and joy.
ISLAMONLINE: But what will maintain and preserve this unity? Because if you have something precious you have to have the power to protect it, so what are you going to do to maintain and protect this union when it is established?
ADNAN OKTAR: The basis will, of course, be Islamic moral values. But they will all collect around a leader, and that leader is Hazrat Mahdi (as). The system of Hazrat Mahdi (as) will be the spiritual fulcrum of this union. Following that, following the appearance of Hazrat Mahdi (as), there is the return of Prophet Jesus, we can expect the Prophet Jesus to return within 10 or 20 years at the most. This is a certain fact set out in the most trustworthy hadith. But this joy and happiness in the world, the dominion of Islam, will not last long.It will last for a short period of time. And then again an age of degeneration will commence. And the Doomsday is awaited after that.
ISLAMONLINE: Okay, will there be a room for tolerating each member states changing political conditions and appropriate strategies?
ADNAN OKTAR: Of course. This is activity, a union, based on a foundation of love and respect. Turkey, for example, has its own regime. And Iran has its own regime. Everyone will stick to their own regimes and their own faith. And that will be respected. Freedom is the basis of that. It will be based on freedom, democracy, love and peace, but it will be a study in which the main objective will be disarmament. But disarmament cannot happen overnight, of course. It will take time.
ISLAMONLINE: Okay now we are talking about a central authority. Is that going to be in the hand of Turkey as a leader of this Islamic Union? Okay, what are the guarantees that this central authority will serve the interests of all member states in the union? I mean equally.
ADNAN OKTAR: The guarantee is Hazrat Mahdi (as).
ISLAMONLINE: Should any conflict of interest arrises between any two or more member states, what should the union be doing to resolve this conflict?
ADNAN OKTAR: The power of love is very great. The power of love created by Hazrat Mahdi (as) will lock people together in a strong bond of brotherhood. That joy, that affection and this fervent love will not be of a kind that people have ever imagined. People will enjoy a conception of love they have never known or experienced before. Many people today are selfish and egotistical. Those who claim to live by love are actually faking it and are playing games. This is described and imitated in films, plays and books and everyone is familiar with it. Love is imitated in 99% of the world, even a bit more in some places. That will come to an end. People will see real love, genuine love. The power of genuine love is very, very great, very intense, and there will be no such problems in such a system.
ISLAMONLINE: Then you’ve, you’ve hinted out that before, but I want to get it straight from you, will this proposed Islamic Union be based on Islamic Sharia or modern, or the principles of modern democracy? And is there any conflict between both, I mean the Islamic Sharia and democracy?
ADNAN OKTAR: Of course the essence of the Qur’an will be applied, the moral values of Islam as set out in the Qur’an will be implemented. Love and peace will be applied, democracy will be implemented with its true meaning. People can be Christians or Jews, or irreligious or very devout with much takwa in a system in which democracy is implemented. The environment will be appropriate for all of these. There is no compulsion in the deen. That is what the Qur’an says.
ISLAMONLINE: Okay, some people say that this goal for an Islamic Union so that these are usually attributed to Turkey, as it presents itself for the region as a super power. What do you have to say on this?
ADNAN OKTAR: A super power will exist only if there are arms. Of course it will be a super power, but it will be a super power in terms of love, affection, peace, justice and law, of protecting and watching over people, and of health and wealth, not in terms of oppression and military might. Because the duty of Hazrat Mahdi (as) is clearly set out in the hadith. Disarmament. That is one of his duties. Disarmament is also a duty of the Prophet Jesus. Hazrat Mahdi (as) and the Prophet Jesus are two brothers descended from the Prophet Ibrahim. They will work together. The Prophet Jesus will pray behind Hazrat Mahdi (as). Our Prophet (saas) states that the Prophet Jesus will put his hands on Hazrat Mahdi’s shoulders and push him to act as an imam during the prayer. You can clearly see this in Bukhari, in Muslim, in Tırmizi in Ibn-i Mace and the Sünen-i Sahih and all other works. These hadith are very clear and totally reliable. Hazrat Mahdi (as) will be the leader of the Muslim world, of the whole world. The Prophet Jesus as the leader of the Christian world, will be his subordinate and his vizier, and these two brothers descended from the Prophet Ibrahim will rule the world in a perfect manner. As you know, degeneration will commence after their deaths.
ISLAMONLINE: Ok, some people regard this union as utopia. That’s how some people see it. Do you really believe it will happen?
ADNAN OKTAR: This is the destiny given by Allah. Nothing on earth can stop this destiny of Allah’s as it makes its way. Destiny is not a force that can halted. For example, if there is something on a video tape, it will inevitably emerge as the tape is played. And that event will happen no matter what. If you watch that tape 30 times that image will still appear 30 times and you will see it on every occasion. Hazrat Mahdi (as) has already come to earth and the Prophet Jesus has returned long ago in destiny. Their prayers have already been performed in their funerals. They have died and Doomsday has taken place in the sight of Allah long ago. It is impossible for Hazrat Mahdi (as) to be stopped. The return of the Prophet Jesus cannot be stopped. These are things that are certain in destiny. The verses of the Qur’an clearly state that the Prophet Jesus will return. I take shelter in Allah from the satan; “And I will place the people who follow you above those who are kafir until the Day of Rising.” says Allah, He says he will give them power over non-believers. This is a verse depicting a world dominion. Almighty Allah says there will be nobody left from the People of the Book who does not believe in you.That is also world dominion, He says “when you return everyone from the People of the Book will believe in you”. This is crystal clear. Anyhow there is a verse in the Qur’an referring to the Prophet Jesus (as) and only for him which states that he is a sign of Doomsday. This is said for the Prophet Jesus (as). No other prophet is referred to in that way. Only said for the Prophet Jesus (as). And Allah also says they did not kill him, did not hang him. Allah raised him into His sight. Allah reiterates that they never killed or hanged him. Allah removed him from the sphere of time and space. In other words, He raised him into His sight. And 2000 years later the Prophet Jesus will re-enter the sphere of time and space. Said Nursi says that the Prophet Jesus will not know who he is when he returns. He says his close followers will know him from the radiance of his faith. He will return in the same clothing. His shoes will be the same. He will be wearing sandals with a thong between the toes. The Prophet Jesus will return with the same long robe and the same personal possessions. He will be sent down asleep. Said Nursi says he will be left with a Christian community very reminiscent of Islam. And he will later read and study the Qur’an, the Torah and the Gospel. The Prophet Jesus will become a Muslim and will call the whole Christian world to Islam. It is impossible for that to be prevented, no power or force can prevent it. Our Prophet (saas) says that Hazrat Mahdi (as) will be born in Medina and will come to Istanbul. He says he will cross over the sea in Istanbul, and it is even mentioned that he will cross by a dryroad. He is referring to the building of the bridge over the Bosphorus. He will cross by dry land. And he says he will plant a standard by the edge of the sea. Everywhere in Istanbul is full of high flags at the moment. And the prophecy of this hadith had been realized as well. And many hadith state that Hazrat Mahdi (as) will not use arms during his work in Istanbul, and will shed no blood and will not waken the sleeper. Our Prophet (saas) says he will capture Istanbul in spirit by reciting the takbir, calling on the name of Allah. This is very clear. This is not something that anyone could deny. The collapse of Darwinism and materialism is also a sign that the system of Hazrat Mahdi (as) is growing and strengthening. I am a herald of Hazrat Mahdi (as). I am someone who prepares the way for Hazrat Mahdi (as). Excellent results are being obtained even through my activities. This means the earth will move when Hazrat Mahdi (as) appears, insha’Allah.
ISLAMONLINE: But, Mr. Adnan where did you get the description of Jesus Christ upon his second coming or advent? What are the sources for this?
ADNAN OKTAR: I learned some of this from the works of Bediüzzaman, some from the hadith and some from scholars.
ADNAN OKTAR: In addition, the Prophet Jesus was wearing clothes and had his own personal possessions with him when he was raised to the sky. Since there is no question of him being sent back to earth naked, he will of course be wearing those same clothes.
ISLAMONLINE: Noone is talking about his coming naked but he can change his clothes to suit the age of the time he’s gonna come.
ADNAN OKTAR: This is how it will be when he was first sent. In the first return. Of course he will change his clothes afterwards. Moreover people will not even be able to recognize the Prophet Jesus (as). Besides he would not wander around with those clothes, that would attract too much attention.
ISLAMONLINE: I think it is a very minor issue. It’s not that. It is a small, minor issue here. Sure.
ADNAN OKTAR: Yes.
ISLAMONLINE: Okay, the idea of forming a union from the Arab world and including Israel has almost never been voiced before and even thinking of such a thing has been regarded as odd. What do you have to say on this?
ADNAN OKTAR: Islam harbors love, affection and compassion. Israel is in a very difficult position and Palestine is in a very difficult position. And when a Muslim sees someone who is in a difficult position, someone among the People of the Book or a Muslim brother of his, he will in any case want to save him and this is in any case an obligatory situation. This is what love, affection and compassion demand. There is no need for Israel to request this. Since they are already in a difficult position, it will be a very good thing for them to be saved and made autonomous, for those walls in Israel to be torn down, for them to do business as they wish in the region and to be able to travel freely and set up facilities freely.
ISLAMONLINE: But what about restoring the Muslim land of Palestine?
ADNAN OKTAR: Of course, as I just said, they are also our immaculate Muslim, faithful brothers who have suffered a very great deal. They will found their own state in the region and be able to travel freely. They will be able to enter Israel freely and make their home there. They will be able to go to other places as they wish. They will be able to go to Egypt or Pakistan or anywhere they want and will live freely and at ease. All this suffering will come to an end.
ISLAMONLINE: Ok. In one of your articles you’ve mentioned that this Turkish-Islamic Union is the only possible salvation for the Palestinian –Israeli conflict. Could you please elaborate on this a little bit?
ADNAN OKTAR: That would be obvious even if I did not say it. It is something that cannot be resolved otherwise even if it goes on for hundreds of years. Because the flow within the system appears to be locked. This problem will be resolved only with Hazrat Mahdi’s (as) intervention and with the power of the Turkish-Islamic Union, and that is openly stated in the hadith. He says that the Dajjal will besiege Muslims in Jerusalem. Dajjal will place the Muslims in Jerusalem in a very difficult position and put terrible pressure on them. He says he will inflict torment and suffering on them and will spill their blood. And Hazrat Mahdi (as) and the Prophet Jesus will intervene and put an end to the situation, we are told in the hadith. The atheist Zionists in Israel are very cruel. They are literally eradicating devout Jews there. Atheist Zionists are inflicting grave suffering on our devout Jewish brothers, but the Prophet Jesus and Hazrat Mahdi (as) will put an end to this cruelty of those atheist Zionist. But this matter is made crystal clear in the hadith.
ISLAMONLINE: Ok. Do you think the climate is now ideal for the foundation for Turkish-Islamic Union?
ADNAN OKTAR: After I have placed the subject the Turkish- Islamic Union on agenda hundreds of developments have taken place. Allah had allowed it to coincide that period of time, this is a coincidence planned by Allah, a beautiful one. A huge acceleration began some 5-6 months after I raised these issues. There have been huge new steps with Turkic states and Islamic countries. I have set these out in a list in my web site. It is set out in detail on the harunyahya.org, harunyahya.com and harunyahya.net web sites. And there have been really astonishing developments. Not just one or two, but hundreds. And these developments are continuing every day, every week and every month.
ISLAMONLINE: Ok. If this İslamic Union is established, what kind of universal impact will it have and what will it plan and what do you think should be their first subject it will discuss?
ADNAN OKTAR: An immediate end to terror and anarchy. An end to conflict. Beginning a policy of disarmament. Love will be put forth with its true meaning. The bonds off brotherhood will be powerfully reinforced. The road will be fully opened up to collaboration on all subjects. Borders will be opened. There will be no more passport and visa problems. People will be able to travel freely to whatever country they wish. And social justice, legal justice, love, peace, brotherhood, joy and happiness will all be distinguishing features of this age.
ISLAMONLINE: Regarding the issue of Turkey joining the European Union, what should convince the EU to approve Turkey’s membership?
ADNAN OKTAR: Turkey will not join the European Union. The European Union will join Turkey. In other words, it will be part of the Turkish-Islamic Union. Because the European Union is an increasingly collapsing and aging one, devoid of any energy. It has no economic power. This economic crisis in particular is a portent of the coming of Hazrat Mahdi (as). Europe’s back has been broken. The only thing Turkey may gain from joining the European Union will only may be concern restoring democracy. But it will gain nothing economically; on the contrary, due to their collapse, Turkey will save them from their swamp by forming the Turkish Islamic Union.
ISLAMONLINE: Many many European experts are talking about the Christian identity of Europe. What will make Europe join Turkish Islamic Union and get rid of their Christian identity?
ADNAN OKTAR They will begin heading toward true Christianity, a Christianity resembling to Islam will begin to develop in Europe. At a time in which they will leave their distorted wrong beliefs behind and continue their way towards the true Christianity, the Prophet Jesus (as) will return. Or else, there will also be a strengthening of Christianity, but this will be in a purging and flourishing style.
ISLAMONLINE: And my last question is what are the practical steps you are taking to achieve this goal, I mean the establisment of Turkish-Islamic Union?
ADNAN OKTAR: The Orthodox will in any case be part of the Turkish-Islamic Union. It will include Russia. It will include Armenia and Israel. There are also Orthodox in Europe. There are Jews and Catholics and various Christian denominations. Because we know that Christianity is divided into several different denominations. Everyone can see that. And they have long been opposed to one another. That will stop and they too will become brothers to each other. These sectarian differences will disappear. There will emerge a pure conception of Christianity similar to Islam and the Qur’an. In other words, the European Union will be puzzled by the Turkish-Islamic Union. Because there are Jews and Christians among them and there will be Jews and Christians in the Turkish Islamic union as well. But this study, the Turkish-Islamic Union is one under the leadership of the Muslims. In this regard this structure is one they can easily adapt to. It will be a structure what embraces them with affection and protects them. The portents of Islamic dominion have already taken place. Such as the occupation of Afghanistan, the occupation of Iraq, solar and lunar eclipses at 15-day intervals in the month of Ramadan which happened twice and the appearance of a comet. Then the appearance of the double-tailed comet Lulin. Apart from those, there are some 300 other portents.There are lots and lots of portents. Anyone visiting my web sites can see those. They have all come about. This shows that the End of Times is moving full speed ahead. They said they would halt the economic crisis. I said there would be an economic crisis 20 years beforehand. I announced it on the basis of the hadith. And it began in 2007. They said the crisis would last just one year. I said it would go on until 2014. Then the IMF issued an official statement saying it would last until 2014. In other words, they had nothing to base themselves on, no scientific basis. They just copied my words. They realized that history would follow that course, they felt it, and saw that there was no escape and that things were moving ahead in destiny. Of course Allah knows the truth. Destiny is moving ahead in all its splendor and all its strength. I believe that Hazrat Mahdi (as) is already alive and at work and that the return of the Prophet Jesus is a matter of moments. Very little time remains. The concrete steps I have taken for union, my struggle against Darwinism and materialism, my efforts to establish ties of brotherhood between Christians and Muslims, the compassion I have shown for the Jews and my efforts to establish friendly ties to them and all my works have been instrumental in millions of people attaining salvation, and an ideal environment for the development of peace and brotherhood has begun to form. But it is very important, of course, to visit my web sites in order to understand this comprehensively and to study all the fine details. Those who do will see that immaculate work has been carried out and that immaculate progress is being made.
ISLAMONLINE: Okay. Mr. Adnan I told you that was my last question but I do have another one, can I ask you?
ADNAN OKTAR: Masha’Allah Of course. I would be delighted.
ISLAMONLINE: What are the international reactions towards your call, in other words what were responses from different Islamic countries to your call?
ADNAN OKTAR: There is enormous excitement in Palestine, one asking for the leadership of Turkey. This has also been reflected in the press and everyone heard about it. These calls are coming from everywhere, from Morocco and Tunisia and Algeria. There are calls from Pakistan. These calls are coming in from the Turkic states. There is this fervor for the Turkish-Islamic Union on all sides. But they are just reproaching saying “okay but when are we going to do this?”. There is a defined time fort his. We are moving toward the time ordained by Almighty Allah. Everything will happen immediately when the time comes, insha’Allah.
ISLAMONLINE: Thank you so much. Dear viewers that was a very very interesting interview with Mr. Adnan Oktar and I am honoured to be with him today. Thank you so much.
ADNAN OKTAR: Masha’Allah, Masha’Allah. Elhamdulillah. May Allah bless you.
ISLAMONLINE: Thank you so much.
ADNAN OKTAR: Insha’Allah, that will be very nice. We can walk where the Prophet Musa (as) trod, insha’Allah.
ISLAMONLINE: Insha’Allah. It is an honour to meet you. Thank you.
Web Siteleri
Makaleler